User talk:RobertKaye/Works Definition

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  • current: 'to create recordings or recordings can be'
  • suggested: 'to create recordings or and recordings can be '

BrianFreud 09:12, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Artist Credit for Works

All of this is exactly why works were always intended, from their initial suggestion on the style list, to use the composer as artist, not just some artist "commonly associated with a work". "Mr Tambourine Man" thus ends up as a work under Dylan, without difficulty, with that work then linked to all recordings of it, be it a Dylan, Byrds, or even Shatner recording. It's only the edge cases like mashups and such where "composer is the artist" gets funky; however, handling those shouldn't require a weakening of the other 99.999% of cases from the "composer" concept to the "commonly associated" concept. (By the way, My Way --> work: Paul Anka, not Sinatra, and Can't Get You Out of My Head --> work: Cathy Dennis & Rob Davis. Sinatra and Kylie are the performers, not the composers.) ACs should then be left to be used for composers with funky credits, rather than turning Work ACs into some sort of pseudo-AR, imho. BrianFreud 09:10, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

A case for no primary artist credit for works

I'll argue that for new schema artifacts—especially works—there should be no direct relationship to artists. Hence, all relationships between works and artists should be provided through ARs.

As I interpret it, works are meant to represent the act of authoring a discrete piece of music, not capturing its performance details. Specific performances of a work are indirectly linked to works by way of recordings and/or tracks. Works are often the product of collaboration between composer, lyricist, librettist, etc. Since ARs exist for these actions, a primary artist credit would be at best redundant and at worst confusing.

I'm of the opinion that works themselves should have no direct relationships to performers. So in the example of Minogue's performance of Can't Get Your Out of My Head, there would be no primary artist per se, and composer and/or lyricist credits should go to Cathy Denis and Rob Davis, not Minogue. We can clearly see Minogue's performance of this work through ARs to the recordings/tracks where she performs it.

PBryan 19:54, 27 September 2010 (UTC)

Pete Marsh from the BBC says:

I'm not sure it's possible to come up with a heuristic for most popular. It's too subjective. Unless you factor chart positions in ! (ahem). I had a chat with Nick because I wasn't entirely sure what the point of the Artist Credit is. It seems to be to provide a quick and obvious association of work with performer. So multiple artist-credits would be pretty useless, I suppose! I'm wondering if there would be some way of ranking the Recorded by relationships to reflect the most popular instead...?

-- 09:51, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

I'd agree with no artist, using ARs, as the best solution, if it's possible. Any concept where "work" simply is under "most popular", rather than some easily determined (and non-subjective) artist - aka "composer" - makes zero sense to me. It's also an idea that, if implemented, seems rather destined to fail, and to create a good deal of negative controversy in its wake. BrianFreud 10:33, 28 September 2010 (UTC)