History:Featuring Artist Style: Difference between revisions

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{{StyleHeader}}
{{StyleHeader}}
=Style for Featuring Artists=
=Style for Featuring Artists=

[[Image:Alert.png]] '''Attention!''' ''This guideline has been changed since the implementation of [[SG5 Disaster Relief|SG5DisasterRelief]] in 2006-01. See [[History Of Featuring Artist Style|HistoryOfFeaturingArtistStyle]] for details.''


Ordering of [[Extra Title Information|ExtraTitleInformation]] which includes FeaturingArtistStyle, [[Part Number|PartNumber]], [[Track Version|TrackVersion]] can be found under [[Track Title|TrackTitle]].
Ordering of [[Extra Title Information|ExtraTitleInformation]] which includes FeaturingArtistStyle, [[Part Number|PartNumber]], [[Track Version|TrackVersion]] can be found under [[Track Title|TrackTitle]].
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==Official Guideline==
==Official Guideline==


This guideline applies to cases in which one or more artists collaborate on a track or release.
This guideline applies to cases in which one or more artists are ''featured'' on a track or release by another artist, but not equally as they would be in a [[Collaboration Relationship Type|collaboration]].


That is, they are given credit on the cover or track listing of a release by another artist in a manner which elevates their contribution above normal liner note credits. Often, the word "featured", "feat." or "featuring" proceeds their name(s).
'''If one artist can be considered the ''primary artist'','''

* '''file the track/release under the primary artist, and'''
'''In the event of this:'''
* '''add [[Advanced Relationships|AdvancedRelationships]] of the [[Performance Relationship Class|PerformanceRelationshipClass]] to link to the secondary artists, and'''
* '''file the track/release under the normal primary artist, and'''
* '''add [[Advanced Relationships|AdvancedRelationships]] of the [[Performance Relationship Class|PerformanceRelationshipClass]] to link to the featuring artists, and'''
* '''append the name of the secondary artists to the [[Track Title|TrackTitle]]<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>/<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>[[Release Title|ReleaseTitle]] as follows:'''
* '''append the name of the secondary artists to the [[Track Title|TrackTitle]]<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>/<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>[[Release Title|ReleaseTitle]] as follows:'''
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">''"Put Your Lights On (feat. Everlast)"''
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">''"Put Your Lights On (feat. Everlast)"''
</ul>
</ul>


An artist being featured or not can vary for the same track, depending on the context. For example, The song ''"Under Pressure"'' may have been initially credited as a collaborative effort by David Bowie and Queen ([http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=437665 e.g.]), but may be credited differently on their respective compilations. e.g., a David Bowie compilation might give Queen a featuring credit ([http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=238538 e.g.]), rather than a additional primary artist credit, or might not credit them outside of the liner notes at all ([http://www.discogs.com/viewimages?what=R&obid=1054835 e.g.]). Use FeaturingArtistStyle or [[Collaboration Relationship Type|CollaborationRelationshipType]] as appropriate, but do not attempt to unify all instances to the same format.
'''If no artist can be considered secondary,'''
* '''[[Add Artist Edit|Create a new artist]] in the form:'''
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">''"Artist 1 & Artist 2"''
</ul>'''and file the track/release under that artist, and'''
* '''add [[Advanced Relationships|AdvancedRelationships]] of the [[Collaboration Relationship Type|CollaborationRelationshipType]] to the new artist.'''

This is an [[Official Style Guideline|OfficialStyleGuideline]]

==Rationale==

Currently there is no way to efficiently assign two artists to a track or release. In order to keep the database consistent and to keep releases and [[Various Artists|VariousArtists]] releases on the release listing of the main artist, additional [[Featuring Artist|FeaturingArtist]]<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>s are added to the [[Track Title|TrackTitle]].

We know that this is ugly, but there ''really'' is no good alternative. Read through the [[History Of Featuring Artist Style|HistoryOfFeaturingArtistStyle]] and the referenced discussions carefully before complaining.

To alleviate the ugliness of this guideline a bit, [[SG5 Disaster Relief|SG5DisasterRelief]] has been implemented. Now artists who collaborated ''equally'' to a track or release can be entered into the database as a [[Collaboration Artist|CollaborationArtist]] and assigned to single tracks without turning releases into [[Various Artists|VariousArtists]] releases. The second part of the guideline deals with this case.


==Details and Discussion==
==Details and Discussion==


* The [[Release Artist|ReleaseArtist]] is the main artist a release is credited to. This means, the artist mentioned on the release cover (in most cases the front cover), package or any other labeled package like entity that describes the release (e.g. release page for online releases).
* The [[Track Artist|TrackArtist]]/[[Release Artist|ReleaseArtist]] is the main artist a track/release is credited to. This means, the artist mentioned on the release cover (in most cases the front cover), package or any other labelled package like entity that describes the release (e.g. release page for online releases).
* A collaboration should only be created for primary artists who contributed ''equally'' to the track/release.
* Do not add any secondary artist to the track title. Secondary artists can be additional voice performers or instrumentalists. Those are often mentioned on the cover of the release the track appears on. Artists that didn't musically perform for this track don't fit in this category.
* For additional contributors who didn't perform on the track, use the various [[Advanced Relationships|AdvancedRelationships]] to define their roles in relation to the track. Those can be contributors to the technical production process (mixers, producers, record engineers, etc.), remixers and others. The different roles are explained in [[Compilation Relationship Class|CompilationRelationshipClass]], [[Composition Relationship Class|CompositionRelationshipClass]], [[Production Relationship Class|ProductionRelationshipClass]], [[Remix Relationship Class|RemixRelationshipClass]]. ''Note, that composers are often the '''main''' artists of classical releases (see [[Classical Style Guide|ClassicalStyleGuide]]) and remixers or compilers can also be main artists if they fit into 1.''
* For additional contributors who didn't perform on the track, use the various [[Advanced Relationships|AdvancedRelationships]] to define their roles in relation to the track. Those can be contributors to the technical production process (mixers, producers, record engineers, etc.), remixers and others. The different roles are explained in [[Compilation Relationship Class|CompilationRelationshipClass]], [[Composition Relationship Class|CompositionRelationshipClass]], [[Production Relationship Class|ProductionRelationshipClass]], [[Remix Relationship Class|RemixRelationshipClass]]. ''Note, that composers are often the '''main''' artists of classical releases (see [[Classical Style Guide|ClassicalStyleGuide]]) and remixers or compilers can also be main artists if they fit into 1.''
* If a track features both "Foo" and "Bar", it should be entered as "... (feat. Foo & Bar)". For more than two: "... (feat. Foo, Bar, Baz ... & Quux)".
* If a track features both "Foo" and "Bar", it should be entered as "... (feat. Foo & Bar)". For more than two: "... (feat. Foo, Bar, Baz ... & Quux)".
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''Comment'': You've dropped out the second part of the current FeaturingArtistStyle, "If no artist can be considered secondary...", which describes what to do in the event of an equal collaboration. I think it's needed here, because I don't see it described elsewhere. Maybe in [[Release Artist|ReleaseArtist]]? If so put a reference to that. [[Collaboration Relationship Type|CollaborationRelationshipType]] doesn't tell the story about creating a [[Collaboration Artist|CollaborationArtist]], that's for sure. —[[User:JimDeLaHunt|JimDeLaHunt]] 2008-02-06
One last question: is the '''&''' in the collaboration artist a must or an example? I see artists added with '''&''' like Queen & David Bowie and '''and''' like Queen and Elton John? This should be mentioned in the notes either way.
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">IMO the previous guidelines was incorrect and shouldn't have been here in the first place. I would be happy to create a [[Collaboration Artist Style|CollaborationArtistStyle]] but it would be little more than "''If two or more artists are credited equally as primary artist on a release, without using a new group name, represent them as a new artist "Artist X & Artist Y" (or, for multiple artists: "Artist X, Artist, ... & Artist Z")''". We need to move away from trying to work out who contributed what to a release, and instead look at how they're credited. —[[User:Gecks|Gecks]] 2008-02-07
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">An example. And we should also mention that an existing collaboration artist like 'A and B' should be picked, even if the sleeve says 'A & B'. This to not create multiple collaboration artists that essentially are the same. --[[User:Zout|Zout]]
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">Indeed, that part of the guideline dates from before collaboration artists (with AR's) were possible. There is no reason in the world to keep it here. -- [[User:KrazyKiwi|KrazyKiwi]] 2008-02-07
</ul>
</ul>

One more: If '''&''' is a must then what is the solution for more than 3 artists? Should also be mentioned in the guideline.--[[User:Fuchs|Fuchs]]
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">Maybe "A, B & C" as a suggestion? --[[User:Zout|Zout]]
</ul>
</ul>


''Comment'': I'd like to see some text at the beginning saying that this does not apply when [[Classical Style Guide|ClassicalStyleGuide]] is in use. Note that CSG and [[Classical Release Artist Style|ClassicalReleaseArtistStyle]] already takes a different position from [[Release Artist|ReleaseArtist]] and FeaturingArtistStyle on how to handle [[Release Artist|ReleaseArtist]] for collaborations. [[Classical Release Title Style|ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle]] is about to discourage FeaturingArtistStyle altogether, I expect. How about this text, after second paragraph of "Official Guideline". —[[User:JimDeLaHunt|JimDeLaHunt]] 2008-02-06
One thing completly confusing me... the section above says "Do not add any secondary artist to the track title." - hu? What do I miss here? --[[User:Shepard|Shepard]]
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">This guideline applies to most [[Musical Genre|MusicalGenre]]<code><nowiki></nowiki></code>s, but it does not apply to entries covered by the [[Classical Style Guide|ClassicalStyleGuide]]. Collaboration takes a different form in [[Classical Music|ClassicalMusic]]. See the [[Classical Style Guide|ClassicalStyleGuide]], and especially [[Classical Release Artist Style|ClassicalReleaseArtistStyle]] and [[Classical Release Title Style|ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle]], for guidance.
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">Not only is it ambigious but it's also contradictory. We need definitions to for terms as part of the styleguide (either embedded or linked from a glossary). I think if we had them, whoever wrote that would realize it didn't make much sense. -- [[User:WolfSong|WolfSong]] 13:21, 13 January 2006 (UTC)
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">Well, I would disagree with dropping FeaturingArtistStyle from the CSG. I think it still has a place there, but I've said my piece on the list. —[[User:Gecks|Gecks]] 2008-02-07
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">That person was me, and I just collected all the stuff that was written all over the wiki. Feel free to either edit it directly (if it really makes no sense) or to work on an enhanced version just below the official one. [http://www.nabble.com/-mb-style-SG5DisasterInTheMaking-t903673c2885.html#a2355406 Fuchs' mail] to the [[Style Mailing List|StyleMailingList]] would be a good starting point. --[[User:DonRedman|DonRedman]]
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">Do we really need to say "Except for CSG" here? It'll apply to every style guideline. It'd be more succinct to put on the CSG "...and ignore every other guideline MB has".-- [[User:KrazyKiwi|KrazyKiwi]] 2008-02-07
</ul>Can we simply remove the section Shepard pointed out? It seems to contradict everything I've learned about how to title tracks/releases with featured artists, and appears to be about collaborations, which have a separate wiki. --[[Arty Smokes|ArtySmokes]]
<ul><li style="list-style-type:none">I agree, but more because using (feat.) is already not part of the current (unofficial) CSG - the only place within CSG it does occur is the messy release title exception in CSG - and that too is just waiting on a database / interface change to go away. I'd think it'd be rather easiest to leave CSG out here, and just add in to the title section of newCSG "until the db can do better, this guideline overrides [[Featuring Artist Style Amendment|FeaturingArtistStyleAmendment]]" or some such. It's cleaner, and makes it so when such a db interface does happen, we only have one guideline, not two, in need of updating. -- [[Brian Schweitzer|BrianSchweitzer]] 17:50, 07 February 2008 (UTC)
</ul>Yes, I think we really need to say "Except for CSG" here. One of the problems MB poses for contributors is that the style guidelines are often inconsistent and ambiguous. Without an "Except for CSG" disclaimer, then a contributor reading this guideline but not the CSG may not know the rules are different there. A contributor who reads both may not be sure which takes precedence. If both refer to the other and both say that CSG (actually, [[Classical Release Title Style|ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle]]) takes precedence where CSG applies, then MB is more consistent and less ambiguous. — [[User:JimDeLaHunt|JimDeLaHunt]] 2008-05-14
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>
</ul>


''Comment:'' This text doesn't define the term "name-check". It would be helpful if it did. — [[User:JimDeLaHunt|JimDeLaHunt]] 2008-05-14
It seems that current practice is to use one feat./collab format for all instances of a track. why can't we have feat. when it appears, and X & Y when it appears? why the need to use one method for every instance of the track? OF COURSE a collaborative artist is likely to appear as a guest on an album of the other artist, but not a guest if that same track appeared on their own album. OF COURSE if a guest collaboration is released as a standalone single, the 2 artists are likely to be billed equally.

Seemingly, whatever format the track was released as first (be it y feat. x, or X & Y) is the one that filters through to every instance of that track. It's absolutely infuriating, especially as this format is generally completely unrelated to the actual contribution of each artist, and purely based on the format of initial release (X's album / Y's album / X & Ys single) - eg, i don't think anyone could argue that Eurythmics/Franklin was a 50/50 collaboration (Eurythmics did all music, wrote the song, Franklin just did guest vocals).

With that said, I really don't think it's our place to decide whether a collaboration was 'equal' or not. Besides, if we did that, we'd just end up having releases as "X & Y" as feat., which was contrary to the sleeve (confusing our users), and vice versa. Can't we just use the format that's on the sleeve of the release in question? --[[User:Gecks|Gecks]]


[[Category:To Be Reviewed]] [[Category:Style]] [[Category:Official Style]]
[[Category:To Be Reviewed]] [[Category:Style]] [[Category:Official Style]]

Revision as of 20:40, 11 June 2008

Template:StyleHeader

Style for Featuring Artists

Ordering of ExtraTitleInformation which includes FeaturingArtistStyle, PartNumber, TrackVersion can be found under TrackTitle.

Official Guideline

This guideline applies to cases in which one or more artists are featured on a track or release by another artist, but not equally as they would be in a collaboration.

That is, they are given credit on the cover or track listing of a release by another artist in a manner which elevates their contribution above normal liner note credits. Often, the word "featured", "feat." or "featuring" proceeds their name(s).

In the event of this:

  • "Put Your Lights On (feat. Everlast)"

An artist being featured or not can vary for the same track, depending on the context. For example, The song "Under Pressure" may have been initially credited as a collaborative effort by David Bowie and Queen (e.g.), but may be credited differently on their respective compilations. e.g., a David Bowie compilation might give Queen a featuring credit (e.g.), rather than a additional primary artist credit, or might not credit them outside of the liner notes at all (e.g.). Use FeaturingArtistStyle or CollaborationRelationshipType as appropriate, but do not attempt to unify all instances to the same format.

Details and Discussion

  • The TrackArtist/ReleaseArtist is the main artist a track/release is credited to. This means, the artist mentioned on the release cover (in most cases the front cover), package or any other labelled package like entity that describes the release (e.g. release page for online releases).
  • For additional contributors who didn't perform on the track, use the various AdvancedRelationships to define their roles in relation to the track. Those can be contributors to the technical production process (mixers, producers, record engineers, etc.), remixers and others. The different roles are explained in CompilationRelationshipClass, CompositionRelationshipClass, ProductionRelationshipClass, RemixRelationshipClass. Note, that composers are often the main artists of classical releases (see ClassicalStyleGuide) and remixers or compilers can also be main artists if they fit into 1.
  • If a track features both "Foo" and "Bar", it should be entered as "... (feat. Foo & Bar)". For more than two: "... (feat. Foo, Bar, Baz ... & Quux)".

Comment: You've dropped out the second part of the current FeaturingArtistStyle, "If no artist can be considered secondary...", which describes what to do in the event of an equal collaboration.  I think it's needed here, because I don't see it described elsewhere.  Maybe in ReleaseArtist?  If so put a reference to that.  CollaborationRelationshipType doesn't tell the story about creating a CollaborationArtist, that's for sure.  —JimDeLaHunt 2008-02-06 
  • IMO the previous guidelines was incorrect and shouldn't have been here in the first place. I would be happy to create a CollaborationArtistStyle but it would be little more than "If two or more artists are credited equally as primary artist on a release, without using a new group name, represent them as a new artist "Artist X & Artist Y" (or, for multiple artists: "Artist X, Artist, ... & Artist Z")". We need to move away from trying to work out who contributed what to a release, and instead look at how they're credited. —Gecks 2008-02-07
    • Indeed, that part of the guideline dates from before collaboration artists (with AR's) were possible. There is no reason in the world to keep it here. -- KrazyKiwi 2008-02-07

Comment: I'd like to see some text at the beginning saying that this does not apply when ClassicalStyleGuide is in use. Note that CSG and ClassicalReleaseArtistStyle already takes a different position from ReleaseArtist and FeaturingArtistStyle on how to handle ReleaseArtist for collaborations. ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle is about to discourage FeaturingArtistStyle altogether, I expect. How about this text, after second paragraph of "Official Guideline". —JimDeLaHunt 2008-02-06

  • This guideline applies to most MusicalGenres, but it does not apply to entries covered by the ClassicalStyleGuide. Collaboration takes a different form in ClassicalMusic. See the ClassicalStyleGuide, and especially ClassicalReleaseArtistStyle and ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle, for guidance.
    • Well, I would disagree with dropping FeaturingArtistStyle from the CSG. I think it still has a place there, but I've said my piece on the list. —Gecks 2008-02-07
      • Do we really need to say "Except for CSG" here? It'll apply to every style guideline. It'd be more succinct to put on the CSG "...and ignore every other guideline MB has".-- KrazyKiwi 2008-02-07
        • I agree, but more because using (feat.) is already not part of the current (unofficial) CSG - the only place within CSG it does occur is the messy release title exception in CSG - and that too is just waiting on a database / interface change to go away. I'd think it'd be rather easiest to leave CSG out here, and just add in to the title section of newCSG "until the db can do better, this guideline overrides FeaturingArtistStyleAmendment" or some such. It's cleaner, and makes it so when such a db interface does happen, we only have one guideline, not two, in need of updating. -- BrianSchweitzer 17:50, 07 February 2008 (UTC)
        Yes, I think we really need to say "Except for CSG" here. One of the problems MB poses for contributors is that the style guidelines are often inconsistent and ambiguous. Without an "Except for CSG" disclaimer, then a contributor reading this guideline but not the CSG may not know the rules are different there. A contributor who reads both may not be sure which takes precedence. If both refer to the other and both say that CSG (actually, ClassicalReleaseTitleStyle) takes precedence where CSG applies, then MB is more consistent and less ambiguous. — JimDeLaHunt 2008-05-14

Comment: This text doesn't define the term "name-check". It would be helpful if it did. — JimDeLaHunt 2008-05-14