Talk:Editing FAQ: Difference between revisions
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(Added more discussion from freenode.) |
(Just copying an IRChat, without formatting, is hardly useful) |
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What about barcodes, publisher, packaging, release date, and format? |
What about barcodes, publisher, packaging, release date, and format? |
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:At this place was an unformatted copy from a freenode chat, see http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/?title=Talk:Editing_FAQ&oldid=46170 |
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From Freenode chat Sat Jun 25 12:27PM EST: |
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<gpeterso> The editing FAQ says releases should be merged if: # tracks same, track titles same, and track lengths within 2 secs. What about barcodes, publisher, packaging release date? |
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<warp> gpeterso: oooh, sounds like that FAQ is outdated |
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* Tecfan has quit (Ping timeout: 244 seconds) |
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<warp> gpeterso: where did you read that? |
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<gpeterso> http://musicbrainz.org/doc/Editing_FAQ#There_are_two_or_more_releases_with_the_same_titles.2C_should_I_merge_them.3F |
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<gpeterso> warp: http://musicbrainz.org/doc/Editing_FAQ#There_are_two_or_more_releases_with_the_same_titles.2C_should_I_merge_them.3F |
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<warp> last changed in 2009. yes, that FAQ has clearly not been updated with the changes for the NGS release |
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<gpeterso> warp: I am about to add a Discussion on the Editing FAQ on the wiki to that effect. Is that the best thing to do? Which criteria is worth another release? Barcode, publisher, packaging, or release date? |
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<warp> gpeterso: all of those |
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<Mineo> + format |
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<gpeterso> warp, Mineo: So, what to do? I don't know who you are, you don't know who I am... Just that we are all interested for some reason. Is there some official party that should rule on this? |
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<gpeterso> warp, Mineo: I can cut and paste this into the discussion page, but there's no discussion going on there. Should I actually edit the wiki? This seems a little, off-the-cuff for an official change. |
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<warp> gpeterso: the StyleCouncil may be the closest thing to an official party in this case. though technically they only govern Official Style guidelines on the wiki. |
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<warp> gpeterso: I'm not sure what the new text would say, otherwise I would edit it properly right now. |
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<gpeterso> warp: Turns out I don't even have permission to leave a comment. |
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<warp> gpeterso: I plan to discuss this with nikki, perhaps we can come up with a new text between the two of us. otherwise we'll ask the style mailing-list. |
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<warp> gpeterso: obviously if you have a suggestion for the text feel free to suggest it on the discussion page. |
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<gpeterso> warp: Can't - don't have password. |
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<warp> gpeterso: hm?, anyone can edit the wiki |
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<warp> gpeterso: the password should be printed in the password box (unless you're using opera, where it gets cut off). |
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<gpeterso> warp/Mineo: I asked because someone voted down my merge. I've now spoken to two others besides that person and met with unanimous opinion that they are right. If consensus counts for anything, I should cancel my merge. |
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<gpeterso> warp: oh, OK, I'm in. I guess I'll edit the actual faq to include the following: |
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<gpeterso> "Different bar-codes, publishers, packaging, release dates, and formats may be sufficient reasons NOT to merge." |
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<warp> ok |
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<gpeterso> warp: that way rules lawyers like me will be more amenable to doing the right thing. |
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<gpeterso> Thanks, warp. |
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<gpeterso> warp: So, to play devil's advocate for one more minute, the release in question looks like a redistribution of an earlier release - same material, distributed again. That seems very, well, "same" to me. Why should Musicbrainz want to call that, "different?" |
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<gpeterso> warp: Why should a mere barcode block a merge? As a consumer of the CD, it seems otherwise identical to me. |
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<gpeterso> warp/Mineo: Oh, we forgot to mention distributors. The release in question has a different distributor. |
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<reosarevok> gpeterso: now we can say they are different releases, but they share the musical content |
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<reosarevok> So nothing is actually lost |
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<reosarevok> While the difference is captured |
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* yindesu (~yindesu@adsl-76-252-27-114.dsl.ipltin.sbcglobal.net) has joined #musicbrainz |
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<yindesu> When you merge releases does it merge the recordings as well? |
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<reosarevok> (also, in some cases things like cover artists, designers etc will change even though the musical content is the same) |
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<reosarevok> IIRC the method is called "Merge mediums and recordings" |
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<reosarevok> So I'd expect it to |
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<yindesu> alright |
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<yindesu> I'm completely fed up with the broken Edit Medium system |
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<gpeterso> reosarevok: so you would merge them if the musical content is the same? |
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<yindesu> i'm going to start adding new releases instead of editing tracklists |
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<reosarevok> gpeterso: no |
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<reosarevok> I'd merge their recordings :) |
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<yindesu> 56 failed edits because of this is getting dumb. |
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<yindesu> (and more coming) |
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<gpeterso> reosarevok: you lost me. |
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<reosarevok> Different releases can share recordings |
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<yindesu> another question since we're talking about recordings |
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<gpeterso> reosarevok: You can do that? Merge a recording without merging a release? |
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<reosarevok> (the entities which indicate a single, well, recording (+mixing/mastering, in theory) of a song) |
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<yindesu> should Recordings with different volume levels be merged? (If the audio is pretty much identical if you apply the appropriate replaygain level) |
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<reosarevok> gpeterso: Yes you can :) |
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<yindesu> I'm not sure where the mastering/etc engineer relationships go |
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<yindesu> if recordings which aren't 100% identical (besides silence blocks) are merged |
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<reosarevok> yindesu: I know nothing about volume levels so I can't say… let's see what people who do say :) |
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<yindesu> kepstin entered an edit to merge 2 such recoredings a while ago, i didn't say anything b/c i wasn't thinking about engineer relationships |
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<gpeterso> yindesu: Interesting question - presumably the one with higher gain (without distortion) actually captures more data (more dynamic range). |
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<reosarevok> I imagine it might be hard, even if was desirable (which I'm not sure), to keep them separate, as most people won't really have an easy way of checking it |
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<bitmap> yindesu: I've seen v�olume levels often vary between different releases of CDs (even when they're not marketed as remastered), but I definitely still merge them |
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<reosarevok> So unless the engineer was different and the relationship was present, someone would probably merge them anyway |
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<bitmap> otherwise we'd have a ridiculous amount of duplicate recordings with no benefit |
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<gpeterso> I need to go very shortly, but I'm going to paste the rest of this into the Edit page on the wiki before I do. |
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<derwin> I say if the record comapny is pretending it's the same.. it's the same.. |
Revision as of 20:54, 14 December 2011
RE: Merging releases
The editing FAQ says releases should be merged if:
the number of tracks is the same the track titles are the same track lengths within 2 secs
What about barcodes, publisher, packaging, release date, and format?
- At this place was an unformatted copy from a freenode chat, see http://wiki.musicbrainz.org/?title=Talk:Editing_FAQ&oldid=46170