User:Symphonick/unofficial csg track names: Difference between revisions

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{{Status| My research, questions & comments for the upcoming CSG for track names. This is NOT a guideline. It's for discussion. Possible future use: CSG examples that won't be in the official guideline.}}
{{Status| My research, questions & comments for CSG Track Titles. This is NOT a guideline. Possible future use: Detailed CSG examples.}}


==Detailed examples of how to enter classical track titles in MB==
Classical track titles should be entered as they are on the liner, following normal [[MusicBrainz]] style guidelines. There are some exceptions, and some things the editor should be aware of when entering "classical" track titles in MB.
I've tried to copy the tracklists exactly as printed on the releases.

==Track names are subtiles==
On classical releases, tracknames are often subtitles of a multi-part work, for example a symphony with four movements. On the tracklist, it could be printed like this on the back side of the CD jewel case:<br/>


===Bach: Cello Suites===
'''Johann Sebastian Bach''' (1685-1750)<br/>
'''Johann Sebastian Bach''' (1685-1750)<br/>
Suites for Solo Violincello BWV 1007-1012<br/>
Suites for Solo Violincello BWV 1007-1012<br/>
Line 16: Line 15:
''Example from Meridian CDE 84270''
''Example from Meridian CDE 84270''


Enter as:<br/>
And the track names & credits in Musicbrainz will be:<br/>
1. Suite no. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Prélude<br/>
<pre>
1. Suite No. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Prélude Johann Sebastian Bach / Simon Rowland-Jones
2. Suite no. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Allemande<br/>
2. Suite No. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Allemande Johann Sebastian Bach / Simon Rowland-Jones
</pre>


Guidelines in effect:
''This is similar to subtitle style for relases, the part after the track number is only a subtitle.''
*CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
*It's ''very'' unlikely that a track name is only "III. Allegro"
*CSG/Language English: "no." should be lower cased
*For artist credits, we use those printed. It's often the same as the release artist-field. ???
*''Or only performers? or only composer, like pre-NGS? (also see next example)''
<br/>
<br/>


For bigger works, the main title isn't always written close to the tracks, it could even be the title of the disc:


===Bach: St John Passion===
'''St John Passion'''<br/>
'''St John Passion'''<br/>
Johannespassion<br/>
Johannespassion<br/>
Line 40: Line 36:
''Veritas 7243 5 62019 2 7''
''Veritas 7243 5 62019 2 7''


English version is entered as:
English version (only complete language) is entered as:<br/>
1. St John Passion, BWV 245: Part One, no. 1: Chorus: Herr, unser Herrscher<br/>
<pre>

1. St John Passion, BWV 245: Part One: No. 1 Chorus Herr, unser Herrscher
Guidelines in effect:
</pre>
*CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
We separate catalog numbers from the rest of the title with a comma. For the BWV 1007 example above, the label had already used that format.<br/>
*CSG/Language English: comma & space before catalogue
*join "section" & part with comma?
*"separate sections of a title with colon?" We need a guideline for what to do when different sections of a title is originally separated only by different font styles.
''Note that according to Wikipedia, both "St John" & "St. John" are correct.''
''Note that according to Wikipedia, both "St John" & "St. John" are correct.''
*''maybe Part One, no. 1: Chorus. Herr, unser Herrscher''
*''For the guidelines, maybe we should try to find an example without languagemixing.''
*''Chorus "Herr, unser Herrscher" would work here, but may create confusion in tracklists where "chorus" is left out (in old CSG there was a tendency to put quotes around all titles).''
*What do we use as track artist here? "as printed" would, I assume, mean repeating all ARs for this recording?

**or stick with always composer as before?


===Compilation release: Berlioz, Wagner===
===But not always (compilation titles)===
Side 1:<br/>
Side 1:<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
Line 63: Line 62:


''(1) was used on the cover to indicate a performer.''<br/>
''(1) was used on the cover to indicate a performer.''<br/>
Enter as:<br/>
<pre>1. "Hail, all hail to the Queen," from "Les Troyens"
2. "Träume" - "Schmerzen" from the "Wesendonck" Lieder</pre>
1. "Hail, all hail to the Queen," from "Les Troyens"<br/>
2. "Träume" - "Schmerzen" from the "Wesendonck" Lieder<br/>
Titles like these used to be "forbidden" in MB before NGS.<br/>
''The digit & period to the left of every title shows the track number, it's not a part of the title you enter.''
*''track credits would mean repeating ARs?''


Guidelines in effect:
==Liner with multiple languages==
*CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
If the title is presented in multiple languages, only one should be used.
*join lines if a title is printed on more than one line
*leave out librettists & composers from a title


'''Tři moteta pro smíšený dvojsbor a cappella,''' op. 110<br/> Drei Motetten for double-chorus a cappella, Op. 110<br/> 1. Ich aber bin elend [Já pak ztrápený jsem] (Žalm 69)<br/>


===Translated title===
With the information given, I can choose to enter an official tracklist in either Czech or German.<br/>
(must check which version is performed)
German:

<pre>1. Drei Motetten for Double-chorus a cappella, Op. 110: 1. Ich aber bin elend</pre>
'''Tři moteta pro smíšený dvojsbor a cappella,''' op. 110<br/> Drei Motetten for double-chorus a cappella, Op. 110<br/> 1. Ich aber bin elend [Já pak ztrápený jsem] (Žalm 69)<br/>
Czech ''(removing the brackets that were used to separate the 2 languages)'':
<pre>1. Tři moteta pro smíšený dvojsbor a cappella, op. 110: Já pak ztrápený jsem (Žalm 69)</pre>


*Use only text from the liner for an official tracklist
Don't translate, only use text from the liner. In the German example above, some words are in English ("for Double-chorus"). Just leave them in. If you want to add a translated tracklist, see below for information about pseudo-relases.<br/>
Also it's important to be consistent within a tracklist. If you use the German text from the liner for track 1, don't switch to the Czech version for track 2.<br/>




===Bach Edition: Keys in English/German===
Many times only one part of the title (usually keys) is written in more than one language:<br/>
'''Sonata No. 6 in G major/G Dur BWV1019'''<br/>
'''Sonata No. 6 in G major/G Dur BWV1019'''<br/>
9. Allegro<br/>
9. Allegro<br/>
Line 90: Line 86:
''from Brilliant Classics 93101/21''<br/>
''from Brilliant Classics 93101/21''<br/>


English is the only complete language available:<br/>
We have English "G major" and German "G Dur". Let's say I'm entering this in English:
<pre>9. Sonata No. 6 in G major BWV 1019: Allegro
9. Sonata No. 6 in G major, BWV 1019: Allegro<br/>
10. Sonata No. 6 in G major BWV 1019: Largo</pre>
10. Sonata No. 6 in G major, BWV 1019: Largo<br/>

Also note that we standardize the formatting of the catalog number (following that particular catalog). ''link to Wikipedia goes here. or maybe we must do our own wikipage'' If in doubt, just leave it as it is on the liner.

===Translated track names (pseudo-release)===
The word

==Capitalization==

Capitalization should follow standard capitalization for the language, but librettos & quotes should follow sentence style. This applies to English too, even if English Cap. Standard says otherwise.


===Dvořák: From Cypresses===
'''Antonin Dvořák<br/>
'''Antonin Dvořák<br/>
From Cypresses, B.152'''<br/>
From Cypresses, B.152'''<br/>
Line 109: Line 97:
''apex 0927 40603 2''<br/>
''apex 0927 40603 2''<br/>
<br/>
<br/>
<pre>9. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 2 Death reigns in many a human breast
9. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 2: Death reigns in many a human breast<br/>
10. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 3 When thy sweet glances on me fall</pre>
10. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 3: When thy sweet glances on me fall<br/>

Guidelines in effect:
*CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
*CSG/Language English: comma & space before catalogue
*CSG/Language English: space before numbers
*"separate sections of a title with colon?"
*CSG/Language English: Sentence-style quotes


'''Not''' Death Reigns in Many a Human Breast. Don't use the "Guess case"-button.


===Berlioz: Les nuits d'été (Philips)===


'''LES NUITS D'ÉTÉ, OP. 7'''<br/>
'''LES NUITS D'ÉTÉ, OP. 7'''<br/>
Line 121: Line 116:
''Philips 6500 009''<br/>
''Philips 6500 009''<br/>


Enter as (note that it's a German release):
Enter as (note that it's a German release):<br/>
<pre>1. Les nuits d'été, Op. 7: Villanelle (Tenor)
1. Les nuits d'été, op. 7: Villanelle (Tenor)<br/>
2. Les nuits d'été, Op. 7: Le spectre de la rose (Alt)</pre>
2. Les nuits d'été, op. 7: Le spectre de la rose (Alt)<br/>
Don't add composers, librettists, performers or labels to the track title.


Guidelines in effect:
From a different release:<br/>
*CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
*CSG/Language German: "op." lovercased?
*(CSG/Track Title: roles in brackets)


===Berlioz: Les nuits d'été (DG)===
'''Les nuits d'été, op. 7'''<br/>
'''Les nuits d'été, op. 7'''<br/>
Poésies de Théophile Gautier<br/>
Poésies de Théophile Gautier<br/>
Line 136: Line 134:
''Deutsche Grammophon 2532 047''<br/>
''Deutsche Grammophon 2532 047''<br/>


This is a multi-language release, but only the word "Seite/Side/Face" is written in more than one language, so the difference between a English and a French tracklist would be how to capitalize the word "opus". In French:<br/>
This is a multi-language release, but only the word "Seite/Side/Face" is written in more than one language. The difference between a English/German & French would be how to capitalize the word "opus" (if it is something else than "op." in French?)
Or does French make more sense here because of "Poésies de Théophile Gautier"?
<pre>1. Les Nuits d'été, op. 7: Villanelle. Allegretto
2. Les Nuits d'été, op. 7: Le Spectre de la rose. Adagio un poco lento e dolce assai
3. Les Nuits d'été, op. 7: Sur les lagunes. Lamento. Andantino</pre>




===Sjostakovitj: Piano Concerto No. 1 (1 track, 2 mvts)==
==Tracks with 2 or more works==
It happens that 2 movements/songs are combined into one track.<br/>

'''Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, op.35<br/>
'''Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, op.35<br/>
(Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings)'''<br/>
(Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings)'''<br/>
Line 154: Line 148:
''Decca 436 239-2''<br/>
''Decca 436 239-2''<br/>


Enter as:<br/>
<pre>Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): I Allegretto
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): II Lento
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): I Allegretto<br/>
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): III Moderato — IV Allegro con brio</pre>
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): II Lento<br/>
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): III Moderato — IV Allegro con brio<br/>

This release had a delimiter. The next example has not:


===Williams: Superman suite (combined mvts, no printed delimiter)===
[3] '''"SUPERMAN" SUITE'''<br/>
[3] '''"SUPERMAN" SUITE'''<br/>
(John Williams) Warner Bros<br/>
(John Williams) Warner Bros<br/>
Line 167: Line 161:
''Windsong International KOR042''<br/>
''Windsong International KOR042''<br/>


<pre>3. "Superman" Suite: (i) March of the Villains (ii) Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) (iii) Main Theme
3. "Superman" Suite: (I) March of the Villains (II) Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) (III) Main Theme<br/>
or is it: 3. "Superman" Suite: (i) March of the Villains / (ii) Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) / (iii) Main Theme</pre>
*''or: I. March of the Villains / II. Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) / III. Main Theme<br/>
''note that this example actually follows English cap standard?''




==Multiple tracklists on one release==


==Bach: St. Matthew Passion (cover vs. booklet)==
If there are more than one name available on a release, use the more detailed version. Usually what's inside the booklet is better than what's on the backside of the cover.



''Cover:''<br/>
''Cover:''<br/>
Line 191: Line 184:




*CSG/Track Title: use the more detailed version (inside the booklet)
In some rare cases, you will have to mix leaflet & cover data.<br/>

===Rare case: mixing leaflet & cover data===
''cover:''<br/>
''cover:''<br/>
'''Kreisler: Complete Arrangements & Original Works, including:'''<br/>
'''Kreisler: Complete Arrangements & Original Works, including:'''<br/>
Line 206: Line 201:
9. Larghetto (from Weber's Violin Sonata)</pre>
9. Larghetto (from Weber's Violin Sonata)</pre>
For tracks 8 & 9 I used the variant as printed on the cover (back).
For tracks 8 & 9 I used the variant as printed on the cover (back).

==Release language==
This is everything from the [[Proposal:CSGv2/Release/Language_and_Script|old proposal]]:<br/>
''The Release Language setting for a release should reflect the language used for the track titles. It does not reflect the language spoken or sung on the release, nor any of the specific languages found on the liner for any given release of the same recording.''

Revision as of 14:27, 26 May 2012

Status: My research, questions & comments for CSG Track Titles. This is NOT a guideline. Possible future use: Detailed CSG examples.

Detailed examples of how to enter classical track titles in MB

I've tried to copy the tracklists exactly as printed on the releases.

Bach: Cello Suites

Johann Sebastian Bach (1685-1750)
Suites for Solo Violincello BWV 1007-1012
Volume 1 Suites 1 - 3
Transcribed for viola and played by Simon Rowland-Jones

Suite No. 1 in G, BWV 1007
[1] Prélude
[2] Allemande
Example from Meridian CDE 84270

Enter as:
1. Suite no. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Prélude
2. Suite no. 1 in G, BWV 1007: Allemande

Guidelines in effect:

  • CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
  • CSG/Language English: "no." should be lower cased



Bach: St John Passion

St John Passion
Johannespassion
Passion selon saint Jean
BWV 245
[snip a page with performer info]
Parte prima
Part One . Erster Teil . Première partie
1 No.1 Chorus Herr, unser Herrscher
Veritas 7243 5 62019 2 7

English version (only complete language) is entered as:
1. St John Passion, BWV 245: Part One, no. 1: Chorus: Herr, unser Herrscher

Guidelines in effect:

  • CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
  • CSG/Language English: comma & space before catalogue
  • join "section" & part with comma?
  • "separate sections of a title with colon?" We need a guideline for what to do when different sections of a title is originally separated only by different font styles.

Note that according to Wikipedia, both "St John" & "St. John" are correct.

  • maybe Part One, no. 1: Chorus. Herr, unser Herrscher
  • Chorus "Herr, unser Herrscher" would work here, but may create confusion in tracklists where "chorus" is left out (in old CSG there was a tendency to put quotes around all titles).


Compilation release: Berlioz, Wagner

Side 1:

Hector Berlioz (1803-1869)
"Hail, all hail to the Queen,"
from "Les Troyens" (translation Edward J. Dent)

Richard Wagner (1813-1883)
"Träume" - "Schmerzen" (1)
from the "Wesendonck" Lieder
Philips 69588 011

(1) was used on the cover to indicate a performer.
Enter as:
1. "Hail, all hail to the Queen," from "Les Troyens"
2. "Träume" - "Schmerzen" from the "Wesendonck" Lieder

Guidelines in effect:

  • CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
  • join lines if a title is printed on more than one line
  • leave out librettists & composers from a title


Translated title

(must check which version is performed)

Tři moteta pro smíšený dvojsbor a cappella, op. 110
Drei Motetten for double-chorus a cappella, Op. 110
1. Ich aber bin elend [Já pak ztrápený jsem] (Žalm 69)

  • Use only text from the liner for an official tracklist


Bach Edition: Keys in English/German

Sonata No. 6 in G major/G Dur BWV1019
9. Allegro
10. Largo
from Brilliant Classics 93101/21

English is the only complete language available:
9. Sonata No. 6 in G major, BWV 1019: Allegro
10. Sonata No. 6 in G major, BWV 1019: Largo

Dvořák: From Cypresses

Antonin Dvořák
 From Cypresses, B.152
 9 No.2 Death reigns in many a human breast
10 No.3 When thy sweet glances on me fall
apex 0927 40603 2

9. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 2: Death reigns in many a human breast
10. From Cypresses, B. 152: No. 3: When thy sweet glances on me fall

Guidelines in effect:

  • CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
  • CSG/Language English: comma & space before catalogue
  • CSG/Language English: space before numbers
  • "separate sections of a title with colon?"
  • CSG/Language English: Sentence-style quotes


Berlioz: Les nuits d'été (Philips)

LES NUITS D'ÉTÉ, OP. 7
Gedichte von Théophile Gautier
1. Villanelle (Tenor) 2. Le spectre de la rose (Alt)
Philips 6500 009

Enter as (note that it's a German release):
1. Les nuits d'été, op. 7: Villanelle (Tenor)
2. Les nuits d'été, op. 7: Le spectre de la rose (Alt)

Guidelines in effect:

  • CSG/Track Title: subtitle-style
  • CSG/Language German: "op." lovercased?
  • (CSG/Track Title: roles in brackets)

Berlioz: Les nuits d'été (DG)

Les nuits d'été, op. 7
Poésies de Théophile Gautier
1. Villanelle. Allegretto
2. Le spectre de la rose.
Adagio un poco lento e dolce assai
3. Sur les lagunes. Lamento. Andantino
Deutsche Grammophon 2532 047

This is a multi-language release, but only the word "Seite/Side/Face" is written in more than one language. The difference between a English/German & French would be how to capitalize the word "opus" (if it is something else than "op." in French?) Or does French make more sense here because of "Poésies de Théophile Gautier"?


=Sjostakovitj: Piano Concerto No. 1 (1 track, 2 mvts)

Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, op.35
 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings)
 Raymond Simmons — trumpet
[2] I Allegretto
[3] II Lento
[4] III Moderato —
IV Allegro con brio
Decca 436 239-2

Enter as:
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): I Allegretto
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): II Lento
Piano Concerto No. 1 in C minor, Op. 35 (Concerto for piano, trumpet and strings): III Moderato — IV Allegro con brio

Williams: Superman suite (combined mvts, no printed delimiter)

[3] "SUPERMAN" SUITE
(John Williams) Warner Bros
(i) March Of The Villains
(ii) Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme)
(iii) Main Theme
Windsong International KOR042

3. "Superman" Suite: (I) March of the Villains (II) Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) (III) Main Theme

  • or: I. March of the Villains / II. Can You Read My Mind (Love Theme) / III. Main Theme


Bach: St. Matthew Passion (cover vs. booklet)

Cover:
[2] Gerne will ich mich bequemen
(Matthäuspassion)

Booklet (tracklist):
Matthäuspassion BWV 244
St. Matthew Passion - Passion selon Saint-Matthieu
[2] 23. Arie >>Gerne will ich mich bequemen<<
Text: Picander (= Christian Friedrich Henrici)
Deutsche Grammophon 463 518-2

2. Matthäuspassion, BWV 244: 23. Arie >>Gerne will ich mich bequemen<<

No changing of the quotes here, use the printed version. Previously only double-quotes were allowed.


  • CSG/Track Title: use the more detailed version (inside the booklet)

Rare case: mixing leaflet & cover data

cover:
Kreisler: Complete Arrangements & Original Works, including:
'A May Breeze' (from Mendelssohn) • Romanze Op. 94 (from Schumann) • Sérénade Espagnole Op. 20 No. 2 (by Glazunov) • Ballet in G (from Schubert's Rosamunde) • Larghetto (from Weber's violin sonata) [snip] and many more

leaflet:
1. 'A May Breeze' (Mendelssohn) • 2. Romanze Op. 94 (Schumann) • 3. La Précieuse in the style of Couperin* [snip] 8. Ballet in G (Schubert) • 9. Larghetto (Weber) [snip]

As we can see the tracklist on the cover is incomplete, but some songs had more information than in the booklet. Use the more informative version: 

1. 'A May Breeze'
[snip]
8. Ballet in G (from Schubert's Rosamunde)
9. Larghetto (from Weber's Violin Sonata)

For tracks 8 & 9 I used the variant as printed on the cover (back).

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