Difference between revisions of "User talk:Kuno/Style/Titles"

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==General==
 
 
With so many commonly referenced guidelines consolidated, it'll become somewhat difficult to reference them. Even something like "Expand abbreviations (aka: Abbreviation Style)" would make referencing them far simpler, as well as making past edit notes which referenced those guidelines easier to follow as we move into the future and new editors come in (ones who've never seen the now-defunct guideline wiki pages). [[BrianFreud]]
 
 
==Titles==
 
 
These should likely be hyperlinked down to the subsections below for ease of navigation. [[BrianFreud]]
 
: That would seem redundant to me as there is a TOC which already contains all (and more) of those links. The TOC can be hidden with "<nowiki>__NOTOC__</nowiki>" written into the article, but I think it adds value on a long page such as this. --[[User:PavanChander|navap]] 00:11, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 
:: The bit I find confusing, or perhaps the better word is "redundant", is having the entire text, from "When entering a release..." to "==Detailed guidelines==", visible both in the TOC, then immediately it appears again, but now not hyper-linked. There's no additional text there to add value. Getting rid of the TOC seems detrimental, but what would make sense, and having tested it, it looks improved, would be this... (kind of hard to visualize unless you just edit it in, then preview it). Change the text there from the current, to this comment-inserted version instead:
 
<code><pre>
 
When entering a release or track title into MusicBrainz, please adhere to the following guidelines:
 
<!--
 
* Follow the appropriate [[Capitalization Standard]]
 
* Expand abbreviations
 
* Use parentheses for extra information
 
* Use a colon (:) to separate multi-line parts
 
* Use a slash (/) to separate multiple titles
 
* Use a comma (,) to separate words such as Volume or Part from the title itself
 
 
==Detailed guidelines==
 
-->
 
</pre></code>
 
Now the text appears in the TOC, but isn't repeated again until the actual subsection (which the TOC is hyperlinked to). [[BrianFreud]]
 
 
==Use a comma (,) to separate words such as Volume or Part from the title itself==
 
 
Since this isn't always true, with the given exception, I'd suggest shortening the subsection title to just "Separate words such as Volume or Part from the title itself". [[BrianFreud]]
 
 
==kuno/Style/Titles/Exceptions==
 
 
Live Track Style or Soundtrack Style (neither official, but both official de facto), [[Multi-Track_Movement_Style]] (not official, but also official de facto as the most current version for either CSG or CSGv2), Opera Track Style, CSG, etc?
 
 
 
==Featuring artists==
 
==Featuring artists==
   
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::I am just trying to rewrite the current guidelines to be clearer, I don't see anything in there which would require users to translate e.g. 'met' to 'feat.' on an otherwise dutch track title. But if you think that changes the guideline I'll remove it for now, and have it go through RFC/RFV at some point. --[[User:kuno|warp]].
 
::I am just trying to rewrite the current guidelines to be clearer, I don't see anything in there which would require users to translate e.g. 'met' to 'feat.' on an otherwise dutch track title. But if you think that changes the guideline I'll remove it for now, and have it go through RFC/RFV at some point. --[[User:kuno|warp]].
 
::For reference, the only previous discussion I could find on this: http://lists.musicbrainz.org/pipermail/musicbrainz-style/2009-March/007656.html
 
::For reference, the only previous discussion I could find on this: http://lists.musicbrainz.org/pipermail/musicbrainz-style/2009-March/007656.html
:: How about the entirety of the SG5 debates? Personally, I think "feat." falls into the same category as "disc" - a textual workaround to handle somethi
+
:: How about the entirety of the SG5 debates? Personally, I think "feat." falls into the same category as "disc" - a textual workaround to handle something that the database currently can't handle (if only because we haven't created a "feat" AR).
==Follow the appropriate Capitalization Standard==
 
   
I would strike "by Leonard Cohen"; who the example is by isn't important, and it just makes the text that much longer. [[BrianFreud]]
 
* "'''There''' rules are different" should probably be "'''The''' rules are different" [[BrianFreud]]
 
* There's no mention, currently, of ArtistIntent; "confusion the waitress" may very well be "confusion the waitress", not "Confusion the Waitress"... [[BrianFreud]]
 
   
==Examples==
 
   
Having all the examples separated like this makes the relevant subguidelines difficult to follow. Moving them up to the relevant subguideline would make the examples and subguidelines easier to follow, as well as eliminating a huge kind of "blobby" section of the page. [[BrianFreud]]
 
: I disagree with this, I personally like having all the examples visible together in such a prominent manner. Once I've read the guideline text once, it makes it really easy to refer to this table in the future when making edits, instead of having to wade through the various sections and read the text again. If the examples were added inline with their guidelines then I hope that they remain prominent - although that may not help reduce the "blobby"ness, whatever that is ;) --[[User:PavanChander|navap]] 00:11, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
 
:: Personally, I'd rather we added http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Template:Hidden , inlined the examples, and hid them unless the user needs them. That also would allow for additional examples (to reduce cross-guidelines confusion) without increasing the weight of the page. [[BrianFreud]]
 
   
The "Stand Alone Complex O.S.T." example is contrary to the Soundtrack Style guidance about not including "Original Soundtrack" in the title. The "O.S.T." part is also counter to the abbreviation subguideline in this very guideline. [[BrianFreud]]
 
   
===Punctuation===
 
   
* In the examples, · is getting ignored, but, language-depending, it may be perfectly valid. [[BrianFreud]]
 
 
==FeaturingArtistStyle guideline?==
 
 
Esp. given the chaos that led to the creation / current state of that guideline ([[SG5_Disaster_Relief]]), I'm confused - there's essentially none of the guideline here, save the quick mention in "Expand abbreviations" and one example under "Extra information in the title"? [[BrianFreud]]
 
   
 
==MainTitle guideline?==
 
==MainTitle guideline?==
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* An example of proper capitalization for non-English part-words is needed. Something like "Je pars, partie 1". --fedyakov 18:28, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
 
* An example of proper capitalization for non-English part-words is needed. Something like "Je pars, partie 1". --fedyakov 18:28, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
  +
::That looks like a useful example, can you please add it to the page? (follow the same layout as the others, I assume you know how it is written on the cover?) --[[User:kuno|warp]].
  +
:::Done. Another example from an actual liner I've got. --fedyakov 01:42, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
   
 
==VolumeNumberStyle==
 
==VolumeNumberStyle==
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* An example of proper capitalization for non-English volume-words is needed. Something like "Былое и диски, том 2". --fedyakov 18:32, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
 
* An example of proper capitalization for non-English volume-words is needed. Something like "Былое и диски, том 2". --fedyakov 18:32, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
  +
::That also looks like a useful example, can you also please add that one to the page? :) --[[User:kuno|warp]].
  +
:::I've added a bit more complex example instead. --fedyakov 01:36, 10 December 2009 (UTC)
   
 
==PartNumberStyle and VolumeNumberStyle==
 
==PartNumberStyle and VolumeNumberStyle==
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==BoxSetNameStyle?==
 
==BoxSetNameStyle?==
 
If we're unifying Series, Volume, and Part, and eventually getting rid of Disc #, it seems odd to not also include [[BoxSetNameStyle]] here.
 
If we're unifying Series, Volume, and Part, and eventually getting rid of Disc #, it seems odd to not also include [[BoxSetNameStyle]] here.
  +
*Include in what way? It should be in the list of pages this page would replace, but I don't think there's really anything useful we can include from it otherwise. [[User:Nikki|Nikki]] 20:40, 9 December 2009 (UTC)
   
 
==ExtraInformationStyle?==
 
==ExtraInformationStyle?==
 
You have [[Extra Title Information]] listed for replacement, but not [[Extra Title Information Style]].
 
You have [[Extra Title Information]] listed for replacement, but not [[Extra Title Information Style]].
  +
  +
==Track Title Style==
  +
The unofficial (abandoned?) [[Track_Title]] is another that this guideline could and should replace.
  +
  +
==Untitled Release Style==
  +
The unofficial (abandoned?) [[Untitled_Release_Style]] is another that this guideline could and should replace.
  +
  +
==Release Title==
  +
Another unofficial (abandoned?) guideline; [[Release_Title]] is another that this guideline could and should replace. It appears as though that may have even been somewhat of an earlier attempt at a semi-unified guideline, like this one.
  +
  +
==Instrumental Style==
  +
Yet another stub guideline proposal which this could / should eliminate: [[Instrumental_Style]]. It was a stub proposed guideline (long since being used as if official) under the general ETI guidelines.

Latest revision as of 22:21, 20 September 2012

Featuring artists

I have moved this example here, because Murdos thought it wasn't in line with the current guidelines (Murdos' comment was moved along with it).

Title on release Title in MusicBrainz
Weer geen clubhit (met Laberinto) Weer geen clubhit (met Laberinto)

NOTE: "Featuring" is always written in abbreviated form, but not translated when a track uses an equivalent non-english word.

I don't think there's any consensus on that point. Murdos 23:29, 15 November 2009 (UTC)
I am just trying to rewrite the current guidelines to be clearer, I don't see anything in there which would require users to translate e.g. 'met' to 'feat.' on an otherwise dutch track title. But if you think that changes the guideline I'll remove it for now, and have it go through RFC/RFV at some point. --warp.
For reference, the only previous discussion I could find on this: http://lists.musicbrainz.org/pipermail/musicbrainz-style/2009-March/007656.html
How about the entirety of the SG5 debates? Personally, I think "feat." falls into the same category as "disc" - a textual workaround to handle something that the database currently can't handle (if only because we haven't created a "feat" AR).




MainTitle guideline?

The terminology definition aspect of that guideline seems to be missing from the page that's all about that particular terminology. BrianFreud

PartNumberStyle

  • Any information regarding multiple parts in a title has been lost, as has the en-dash, and any discussion of spacing. If this page were current, there'd be nothing in the guideline to specify how anything except a "Foo, Part 1" case should be titled. BrianFreud
  • Any allowance for alternate numbering systems, or part-words other than "Part" has been lost. ("These things are usually not changed by SeriesNumberStyle: * Number schemes other than "1, 2, 3, ..."; e.g. "I, II, III, ...", "One, Two, Three, ...", "1st, 2nd, 3rd" or the use of foreign language numbers.") BrianFreud
  • An example of proper capitalization for non-English part-words is needed. Something like "Je pars, partie 1". --fedyakov 18:28, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
That looks like a useful example, can you please add it to the page? (follow the same layout as the others, I assume you know how it is written on the cover?) --warp.
Done. Another example from an actual liner I've got. --fedyakov 01:42, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

VolumeNumberStyle

  • "Alternative names for volumes may be used, such as Tome, Book, Part, or their non-English equivalents." / "Volume labeling schemes other than "Volume"; e.g. "Series", "Edition", etc." has been lost. BrianFreud
  • An example of proper capitalization for non-English volume-words is needed. Something like "Былое и диски, том 2". --fedyakov 18:32, 8 December 2009 (UTC)
That also looks like a useful example, can you also please add that one to the page? :) --warp.
I've added a bit more complex example instead. --fedyakov 01:36, 10 December 2009 (UTC)

PartNumberStyle and VolumeNumberStyle

"Note that if the MainTitle of a Release is just "Volume 1" or similar then this guideline should not apply!" and the equivalent has been lost. BrianFreud

SplitReleaseTitleStyle

This entire guideline has been lost; "Use a slash (/) to separate multiple titles" includes nothing of this guideline. BrianFreud

BoxSetNameStyle?

If we're unifying Series, Volume, and Part, and eventually getting rid of Disc #, it seems odd to not also include BoxSetNameStyle here.

  • Include in what way? It should be in the list of pages this page would replace, but I don't think there's really anything useful we can include from it otherwise. Nikki 20:40, 9 December 2009 (UTC)

ExtraInformationStyle?

You have Extra Title Information listed for replacement, but not Extra Title Information Style.

Track Title Style

The unofficial (abandoned?) Track_Title is another that this guideline could and should replace.

Untitled Release Style

The unofficial (abandoned?) Untitled_Release_Style is another that this guideline could and should replace.

Release Title

Another unofficial (abandoned?) guideline; Release_Title is another that this guideline could and should replace. It appears as though that may have even been somewhat of an earlier attempt at a semi-unified guideline, like this one.

Instrumental Style

Yet another stub guideline proposal which this could / should eliminate: Instrumental_Style. It was a stub proposed guideline (long since being used as if official) under the general ETI guidelines.